Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Additional information about safety in the game and US Lacrosse's role in safety research and advancement is available at www.uslacrosse.org/safety.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you for writing on this topic and I completely agree with your commentary. In particular the compounding effect of the takeout hit together with the blow to the head and or cross-check needs to be eliminated. This needs to be coached at the youth level and carried through more advances stages of competition. I also believe officials need to be accountable for their lack of or inconsistent enforcement.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you Steve for this post and for the directing USL's efforts in this regard.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you for this article. My two grandsons have been the receiver of the hits described in this article. One has had 6 concussions and the other 2. They have both been taken to the hospital numerous times. I know you are advocating a sport that shouldn't be played with intensity but one played with ability, etc. The irony of the resulting injuries my boys incurred was that mosts hits were committed late and some of the others were completely uncalled for and didn't have any result of the outcome of anything. I think the solution has to start with the officials ejecting the flagrant athletes from the game.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I also thank you for your post. I have been asking to whom parents need to write in order to comment on this situation. I have two players, one who will still be playing in high school next season, and one in college. If I add up all of the injuries to our boys from previous years, they are still fewer than this past season. ( 5 concussions, a contusion to the lung which caused coughing up blood for several days, a severely broken collar bone, a broken shoulder blade, and a dislocated jaw) Although I understand that Lacrosse is a contact sport, all of these happened during extremely violent hits. Few penalties were called. The time to take action is now, before our players have injuries that are permanent.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I fully agree with Steve's comment above and feel that we have a unique opportunity to advance the growth of Lacrosse by implementing strict rules. Many parents are removing their kids from full contact sports(football, rugby)and if we enforce Steve's rules it would give these parents a sport that they would feel comfortable letting their kids play.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I appreciate your comments Steve, but I believe the penalties you suggest are little more than a slap on the wrist. Until the organization gets serious about this, the injuries will continue. As the grandparent of a 17 year old who received two concussions from player cross-checking, I am recommending much more serious penalties. The last concussion was serious enough that my grandson has been unable to return to school, he can't sleep and he now suffers from anxiety attacks. The doctors are telling him it could be two years before he fully recovers, if he ever does. The offending player was ejected from the game, thanks to a wise official. I believe that is appropriate for a first time offense. A second offense should result in ejection for the season, and a third offense from the league permanently. There is no place in any sport for players of a mind set of doing damage hits. I also believe the coach should be put on report and penalties applied if they are not controlling their players. Insurance companies having to pay for the medical claims will undoubtedly support this.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you Steve as a parent of a girls lacrosse player we face some similar concerns. This year our team had 4 concussions and 2 with seizures during our season. Compounding the issues of speed, players of different skill levels, refs not seeing all dangerous plays (I am a MS ref.) weight differences, coaching differences, etc allows for a potentially unbalanced/dangerous game.
Lacrosse is an impact sport and it has changed dramatically since its inception. We need to consider these differences, player strength, field conditions, equipment, etc. and adjust the rules to err on the side of safety.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve,

Wonderful article and appropriate timing. I think we ought not to confuse tradition with exceptional play. The tradition of lacrosse is based on exceptional play--it's the essence of the game. Both the men's and women's game is built on speed, tempo and agressive play to gain/maintain possession and execute one team's will upon another. Appropriate contact should occur, but within the bounds and limits of the rules. Having coached boy's high school in a couple areas where the game is still young, the emphasis sometimes can be shifted (often inadvertantly) to an emphasis on contact, rather than pursuing better stick skills and teamwork--especially at the high school level where 9-12 graders play on the same team. Game tempo is slow (but the players are fast and larger), the ball is on the ground a lot (players heads are down; the game becomes hockey), the players are less comfotable moving the ball (therefore players hold the ball too long), and the individual/team lax IQ is low (plyers don't see and sense the field). All of this adds risk to the game where the sport is growing. In the girl's game, there is a reason experience minimums are established before a league can use the full check rules. Should the same concept be considered in the boys game in developing areas to continue and maintain the growth of the game? Let's push on this issue and get back to being the fastest game on two feet!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I would rather see increased requirements of protective gear instead of limiting game physicality. The threat of a strong check is what keeps lacrosse interesting and prevents it from become field basketball. It risks becoming an exercise in form - the check forces the play to happen and keeps it honest. Totally down with the concern of injury - especially concussion, but would rather see better protective equipment.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Appropriate article but things are not likely to change anytime soon unless a major/catastrophic injury occurs to a player. In the meantime, the very least that leagues (especially club and High school level) can do is to make safety equipment a requirement. I do not mean just helmets and ebow pads either. The helmets used at all levels are clearly not made to prevent season or career ending concussions nor are the shoulder/upper torso pads. I coached youth level for 6 years and watched kids get injured time after time and heard both kids and parents say "but he was wearing a helmet, etc!) The helmets should be of at least high school football level standards/specifications as should other pads. While I realize this might seem overkill if contact gets ruled out of the game, my view is that A) contact will never be ruled out; B) even if rules were more strict, there would still be collisions and; C) regardless of the rules, the protective equipment should be of a standard to protect the kids from the worst types of injuries becasue rules or not, injury creating impacts will still occur. Lastly, regardless of any rule changes, it will not matter if officials do not enforce them. I have watched game after game where , even after being told, officials do not penalize equipment rule breakers. With 3 childeren now playing (a son and daughter at D1 programs and another son in HS), I want them to all to enjoy this wonderful sports and not have late in life injuries from needless accidents.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Another related article on the topic from the Boston Globe (May 27):

www.boston.com/sports/schools/lacrosse/articles/2012/05/27/lacrosse_coaches_worry_about_concussions/

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve,

As a former college player, high school coach and parent of several players, I too have very severe concerns over the physicality of SOME lacrosse that is being played. As I have stated to several other coaches, too many coaches are spending way too much time teaching Xs and Os and not nearly enough time "teaching" the game! That is a HUGE part of our problem. It is the TEACHING of the meaning of the game that is LACKING to ALL involved. There is nothing wrong with the game being "physical" it is supposed to be. The issue is the encouragement of violence!

Teach the game properly and we wont need more rules! We, the lacrosse community, have been more focused on expanding the game and strutting like peacocks with the spread of the game, new D1 programs, ESPN Top Ten highlights, fancy new over priced sticks, swag, tilt, "stars" of the game, etc., etc., etc. The game is losing it's soul and the lax community IS a BIG part the reason!

Here are some questions/concerns I have:

1) If the rules that are in place now are NOT effectively enforced, what good is adding new ones? I find SOME of the officiating to be atrocious, dangerous and down right disgusting. I have even removed my varsity team from a game because of dangerous play and TOTAL lack of enforcement of high hits. I have been extremely vocal about the nonsense on the field that has been allowed to occur.

2)SOME coaches, parents and players think that it is cool to injure opposing players and are encouraged to do so!!! I have had coaches hi five their players for getting illegal body check/hits to the head penalties! I have had opposing parents encourage their own kid's team to "break their legs" of my players! I have had opposing parents come down to the sideline and chase my own sons up and down the field cursing at him and/or threatening physical violence against them!! I have had opposing players threaten to "stab" one my players for de-sticking him and causing a turn over!

3) The game goes the direction of the prominent D1 coaches/personalities of the game. In my opinion, they set the tone and are to a great degree "keepers" of the game. If they say "if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying (which I have heard several say at coaching clinics) what are they teaching the youth, JV and high school coaches?

We have a DEEPER problem than coming up with new penalties for stuff that has ALWAYS been illegal! We need to take our game back!

Richard Roy

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve,

The solution is NOT more rules! The solution is proper teaching of the game to parents, players, coaches and officials. The rules we have in place now are not enforced what makes one think that adding new ones will work? Targeting the head has ALWAYS been against the rules, but this is so inconsistently called that I wonder what in the world officials are looking at! Obvious take out checks, charging from long distances, blatant pushes from behind, etc are against the rules, but yet, they still occur!

"Lacrosse" is rapidly turning into nothing more than a classless game than is merely a fascade of lacrosse. The game is turning cheap, shallow, & hollow. It is just a game like football, basketball,& baseball. No meaning.

1) I have removed my high school varsity team from the field because of violent play & intentional targeting of the head that OFFICIALS allowed repeatedly!

2) I have had parents from opposing teams repeatedly threaten physical violence against my players during games!

3) I have witnessed opposing coaches reward, hi five, and encourage their players to "head hunt"!

4) I have had player from opposing teams threaten to stab my players for making a good play!

There is no teaching of the game's roots and meaning, only Xs and Os and winning. The ONLY thing that matters is winning at whatever cost. You want to fix this problem? change the way the game is taught, promoted and publicized.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Having been involved in the sport of lacrosse as a player, parent, offical, coach, administratior, and Foundaion member, I see the growth of the sport as a wonderful result of increased visability. The skill sets of HS players today are amazing and the college players are also an all time high. Measuring stick- watch a D1 NCAA final in 4 year increments and marvel at the changes in abilities. By increasing the player pool, we have done many things. Lacrosse attracts high end athletes that would have gone to another sport. We are suffering from BFS Bigger, Faster, Stronger. Athletes that would have opted for one of the BIG 4, now pick up a stick and become impact players quicker because of their gene pool. I hesitate to offer it up, but if the headgear was as poor as it was in the 70's ( a plastic box on your head with a clothes hanger cage), there would be less head to head collisions today. But that is only part of the concussion problem. The other half is the violent collision. In an effort to become more mainstream, the rules might need to adapt as the world of lacrosse is available to a much more widespread participation group. The best players will be better than ever and the lower end of the skill lever will be lower than before and we strive to be inclusive for them.
Better enforcement of rules and better teaching of the game would assist. I watch loose ball push called numerous times when without the "push", the ball would never become "loose". It's a 30 with possession. I see coaches teaching players to play defense with hands spread 8-10 inches on the shaft and driving that shaft repeatedly into the arms and upper shoulder of an offensive player. I watch players dropping their heads running into a pile to make contact, forget the GB- stop teaching it and start officiating it. I see see players running through crowds to pick GBs with heads down and no regard for opposing players surrounding them and wonder why they are not being protected by the rules when they are suddenly looking at the sky. I see players with concussions when there is no head contact and believe that the game has failed them when maybe a regimen of neck tensers might have lessened or removed the threat. 15 years ago there were few players that were 6 foot 4 and playing midfield running a 4.5, that is the norm now at the hight levels. There were few players that could hit 100 MPH on a shot, now each team as a couple. 30 years ago, you could pick up the game at D3 as a freshman. Today, you can be the D3 equipment manager. The sport is suffering from 2 things right now- popularity and BFS- Bigger, Faster, Stronger. Want players to start to listen, make the penalty fit. Intentional contact to the head, treat it as it should be treated by the sport- Unsportsmanlike Conduct. Language Fouls- Unsportsmanlike Conduct. And Start at 2 minutes. intent to injure- Unsportsmanlike Conduct 3 minutes and take a seat for the rest of the game.
I reffed a JV HS game recently where a player came onto the field in a blow out game with a fiddlestick. He got a 1 minute Unsportsmanlike Conduct foul. The coach high fived him on the way to the box- another Unsportsmanlike Foul BENCH. On what planet did these folks think it was OK to make a joke of the game?

30+ years ago I heard a coach explain his position on our sport very eloquently. "When you embarrass yourself because of your actions on a lacrosse field, you embarrass not just yourself, but your teammates, your club, your coaches, your parents, your town and the sport of lacrosse and I will not tolerate you embarrassing the game of lacrosse." It's a true today as it was then.

IMHO- the rules are fine. enforce them. The game is fine- teach it correctly. The sport is fine- respect it.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve:

We fully support this initiative. Our number one concern is the safety of the players. With that said, I would like to see unnecessary checking of the hands a point of emphasis. As concussions are the forefront of many safety discussions, we also see a lot of broken hands and wrists as a result of checking, and would like that reviewed.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

The officials have to start calling the rules the way they are written. In a recent U13 tournament I had a referee actual say that a cross check to my players head was "unintentional" so he did not call a penalty. Bad referees need to be re-trained or removed.

The cross check hold at the college level has to be eliminated as it rolls down to all the youth levels and officials have become numb to it across the board and i see more hits to the helmet generated by a cross check hold than any other type of helmet contact.

Good body checking technique need to be taught at the youth level and with the explosion of the sport a lot of times that is now being "taught" by a football coach rather than someone who actually knows the sport of lacrosse. Couple that with referees who also do not know the sport and often come from football and you have a situation that leaves players vunerable on the field.

Lastly the way sticks are designed today it is nearly impossible to poke check a ball from a stick. So the checks either stick or body have gotten stronger as more force is needed to create a groundball. Go back to a Super Light II lower side wall and wider face design especially U15 and down and force stick skill development.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Why not use the length of the opponent's injury as a determiner also, to encourage fair play? If you choose to chance injuring a player on an (obviously) illegal hit, then actually injure the player, you should stay out at least as long as the injured player, no expections. All Game? You betcha....then don't do the hit. This will also encourage a better use of sportsmanship rather than gamesmanship. Make your opponent tougher by competition, not injury.
Yes, teaching of the game's roots is absolutely essential, or it IS just another game too. If there is nothing to differentiate lacrosse from other sports, then lacrosse is just a 'watchers' game, like NASCAR or MMA (corrupted from a genuine art). Don't go there, please.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

What a great article.Its about time we step up and possibly go after the coaches who encourage this type of play.I have seen many vicious hits in the youth league and as in the article the coach high fives the player.I am glad my son plays for a club team the encourages fair play and hard work instead.I have seen them beat many teams that seem more intent on hitting than skills.If we don't teach them at the young age then we have no hope.Also I think on the pro level these rules have to also be enforced as they are setting the example.Even as a pro,the sport doesn't pay that well..Why end up with brain problems in later years.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

As a former player, coach, and now official, Mr. Stenersen's comments are exactly on point on what I have witnessed is the growing trend of excessive hitting in youth games I manage. As a defenseman, I was never one to shy away from a tough body check on an opposing player when needed to stop and strong drive to the goal or to clear the crease. But the hits that were once only really used on necessity for those situations above are now seen all over the field, and with an unnecessary ferocity and violence against a too often unprepared opponent. The game has rules, trained officials, and penalties to correct the action of younger players so when they make these types of hits they learn the consequences of their actions on their team's success and on the health of everyone involved. Complicating these efforts are the parents and coaches who yell and scream at the officials who penalize the player who initiates such unnecessary, and illegal, collisions (when a play for the ball would be more advantageous for the team). For parents and coaches to send 7 and 8 year old Tykers out onto the field with the encouragement of "Knock their heads off" and "Make them pay with pain for every goal," all of which I have heard or something to the effect in numerous Tyker games, we are not teaching our lacrosse athletes respect for our fellow players and we are expecting them to be as violent as NFL players. It must start with the coaches, the program commissioners, and most of all the responsible parents who set the tone and expectations for good sportsmanship and safety when their players take the field. Officials can only try and stop the results of poor sportsmanship and often it is too late once the damage is done on the field.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Two issues are undermining the game right now: the elbow throwing take-out check and the cross-check. What's interesting is that the refs are calling the take-out checks about 60% of the time. What drives me crazy is the fact that cross-checks are rarely called. My concern is that the two issues converge and we have a game that's no longer about dignity, integrity, and grace, but rather some gross combination of box lacrosse and NHL hockey. This is field lacrosse. It's a sport that includes contact, but contact is not central to the game. Having grown up and played in Maryland (MIAA A) I can tell you that speed and skill always beat so-called physicality. Lacrosse is at a cross roads right now. We can choose to dumb it down by ignoring the rules and encouraging massive hits over skill, cross-checking (watch the Loyola - Maryland game on ESPN3 again) over good defense, and poor sportsmanship over the competitive spirit that made the game what is is.

As the sport grows, we need to be incredibly careful to protect the spirit of the game. All the posts demonstrate that there's real concern right now about the future of the game. Thanks Steve.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you for addressing this serious issue. I have two boys that play on the same high school team and my youngest son, a first year player, was a victim of 3 brutal hits this season. He had a concussion, a lung contusion in which we spent time at Children's Hospital in Cincinnati, and a dislocated jaw. The latter two hits were intentional and neither were subjected to a penalty call. I also heard encouragement from coaches during these games. My boys just want to play the game , I realize it is a contact sport , but my boys both have played football since third grade and they have never suffered these type of injuries. I think officials need way more training and encouragement to enforce the rules of the game.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thanks so much for this blog post. We included the link in the Greater Houston Lacrosse eNews and within 36 hours it received 171 click-throughs by our local lacrosse parents and volunteer board members. Let's hope for change.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

When I first encountered lacrosse fifty-six years ago it was described to me as a game of speed and finesse, with just enough contact to add spice. How far the game has "evolved" from that! It won't be easy, given all the Neanderthals out there, but we must return to that ideal.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you very much for bringing up this issue. We live in west coast and as you can guess, this is a new but fast growing sport. I among other parents who did not want their son to get involved with football due to the deliberate violent contact, we agreed our sons start to play a exiting sport such as LAX. Now after 3 years of Lacross, I see the the kids are getting obviously taller and bigger, and as we all know 1 or 2 years age different between the teenagers make a big different in their mental and physical. The reason I am bring this up is that I see more and more the deliberate violent contact among the bigger kids just to prove their power and intimidating size. My son is not small and we talk about sportsmanship at home and he does play clean, however I repeatedly see and hear how the coaches encourage their player for roughness. At one game when I approached a coach about his attitude, and all I got was this "after all its all about winning " and walked away. I am aware that every one wants to win including me, but how far do we want to go and at what price? . 1 or 2 or 3 min. penalty is nothing but a soft slap on someone's back of his hand. I think the coaches should strongly apply and enforce the sportsmanship and the Ref's should be more aware of this subject.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

There are two issues confronting the sport right now. The take-out check and the uncalled cross-check. I'm glad Steve brought this topic up: He's spot on. I'm also glad that more than a few comments included reference to the new interpretation of the cross-check. The game is expanding rapidly and I worry that a combination of a shallow pool of coaches and refs will have an ill effect on the game. Everything about field lacrosse is designed for speed and skill. The combination of the two will always trump so-called physicality. Yes contact is part of the sport. No it's not central to the sport. The new coaches need to be trained early, the refs need to call the penalties as they are written, and the fans need to learn what the games all about. John Desko Sr. used to talk about three things when it came to life and lacrosse: dignity, integrity, and grace. Field lacrosse is not box lacrosse. It's not the NHL, and it's defintely not the NFL. Let's all advocate to fix these issues as quickly as we can while there's still time.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I hold a dissenting opinion to the several recent editorials posted by the US Lacrosse President. I have been involved with this game since 1981. I have spent thirty-two years as a coach, referee and player. I believe strongly that teaching basic fundamental lacrosse stick skills (passing, catching, ground balls, shooting, cradling, stick checking, etc.) is the most effective way to build better lacrosse players. Having said that, there are two other skills that need to be taught properly. One is the art of the body check. Body checking, when properly done is an effective defensive technique that requires balance, quickness and timing. A well placed body check will stop shots and passes, gain control of the ball and can ultimately change the momentum of a game. Knocking a player to the ground, although not necessarily the end-goal of a body check, does not by itself constitute unnecessary roughness (or an illegal body check) and absolutely is part of the game of lacrosse. It has been a part of men’s lacrosse as long as I have been a part of the game (which is a long time). The body check is a part of men’s lacrosse and should remain a part of the game. Combined with teaching the proper way to body check we must teach the art of slipping/avoiding the body check. It is a skill that has been around as long as I have been also. I teach it to my players. It requires composure, timing, quickness and finesse. A player skilled in dodging and especially slipping a body check can devastate an opponent’s defense, certainly if the other team has players who prefer to look for body checking opportunities. Strategically it is always better to have kids who can beat the body check and create scoring opportunities.In thirty-two years I have seen a lot of lacrosse. I have seen two concussions and only a few injuries requiring more than first aid and ice. One concussion was a player in a box game who attempted a body check and was juked. After getting juked his momentum carried him into the boards. It was an accident. The second was two junior high school kids who were head-hunting each other in a championship game. They collided head to head. The collision could have been easily prevented by coaches and referees seeing the situation developing and addressing it before it got out-of-hand. I realize that I personally have not witnessed every lacrosse game injury, but on a percentage basis lacrosse is one of the safest sports being played, body checks and all. Comparing football injuries due to collisions and lacrosse injuries due to body checking is silly. Football is grounded in speed, contact and collisions. Comparing any lacrosse body check to an NFL collision is ridiculous. REPEAT AFTER ME: Comparing any lacrosse body check to an NFL collision is ridiculous. Comparing any lacrosse body check to an NFL collision is ridiculous. Comparing any lacrosse body check to an NFL collision is ridiculous. Comparing any lacrosse body check to an NFL collision is ridiculous. Much of the recent concern over head injuries has been fueled by a blanket misunderstanding of the NFL’s concussion awareness policy and studies. Even the NFL did not intend to eliminate head-to-head contact. That would be impossible. The NFL rule on the subject only states that a player may not initiate helmet-to-helmet contact with another player who is in a vulnerable position/state (I.E. a receiver catching a pass, a quarterback passing and unaware he is about to be hit). Once the player (any player) has possession of the ball and has “tucked the ball away” or is otherwise advancing down the field the helmet-to-helmet contact restriction no longer applies. Men’s lacrosse does not need to have any further restrictions on helmet-to-helmet contact, because it is already restricted. Body checking for youth players is already restricted. Spearing is already illegal. Lacrosse players need to be trained properly on body checking and properly avoiding a body check. If we eliminate body checking from men’s lacrosse (yes, even take-out checks) because someone may get knocked down, injured or get their feelings hurt then we must also eliminate stick checking and any throwing of the ball at speeds that could bruise someone. We should also modify the protective equipment rule and have everyone wear those inflatable sumo body suits. We should eliminate running and yelling too. We should stop keeping score so that no one would feel like they lost. I have coached a lot of sports for many years. Sometimes a few people get injured, but it is nonsense to start altering rules unless the injuries are consistent and directly related to poorly written rules. In the case of professional boxing’s Mancini/Kim fight (1982) in which Kim died after taking a beating the rules were altered to allow the ref to stop the fight if he determined a fighter could no longer defend himself. After a few NFL quarterbacks were injured (including Joe Theisman) the NFL changed the rule allowing the referee to call the QB down when he was “in-the-grasp.” Both are examples of rule changes that were appropriate and necessary. Eliminating body checking in men’s lacrosse (even take-out checks at the higher levels), without any indication that the checks create any significant danger to the players is unnecessary and irresponsible. It is eliminating a foundational part of the game for political correctness and riding on an un-needed and misunderstood band-wagon. At the youth level it makes sense to limit contact that could injure someone. There are disparities in player size and ability that tend to level out as the kids grow up. We also need to realize and admit (and help parents and kid’s realize and admit) that this game is not for everyone. In men’s lacrosse (as well as sports like football, hockey and rugby) people get knocked down. They get hit with sticks, pads and helmets.Be careful when reading and/or quoting terms from research studies like “serious injuries” without knowing how they defined “serious” and “injury.” Is that a broken goalie thumb? Is it a bruise on the arm from a stick check. If so, we need to just put a stop to lacrosse all together. Finally, it is my opinion that we do not need to further coddle our children or our citizenry with rules to protect their sensitive natures. There is plenty of that. Men’s lacrosse is a rough game. It always has been. That is okay.One of the beautiful things about the game is that there is a place for many different types of athletes. The small, quick guy. The big, strong guy. The super tall skinny guy. The guy who isn’t too big or fast but works his hardest everyday. Any coaches out there reading this know what I am talking about. With that said, this game is not for everyone. We do not need to change the game to make it accessible to everyone. There are a thousand alternatives that are all great. When one of my 14-year-old midfielders beats his man up-top and drives to the goal at full sprint he gets challenged by the sliding defenseman. Sometimes the defenseman attempts to body check my midfielder, who decides to bull dodge. Since my midfielder is a strong fast kid at full sprint and the defenseman only stepping up, the defenseman loses the “collision” and falls backward into the crease. My midfielder then shoots and scores. Now you make the call…On a few occasions this past year the call was: NO GOAL, 2 MINUTE PENALTY ON THE MIDFIELDER FOR AN ILLEGAL BODY CHECK. I understand some referees have not played the game or ever coached it. They only know what they know from a class or the rule book. There’s a common sense issue there however. First, my midfielder was carrying the ball toward the goal. He had no specific duty by rule to avoid the defenseman. Second, the defenseman initiated the contact. Although the defenseman was unwise to step up like he did (he did not get injured), his falling down should not have constituted a foul on the part of the player with the ball. Too many times penalties are handed out simply because some player was knocked (or fell) down. The above example is tantamount to flagging a football running back for running too fast into the defender at the goal line. I have been told that happened to Franco Harris once but that is another story.Now professional baseball is discussing disallowing the catcher from blocking the plate in baseball…My son is not very good at pole vaulting and he gets hurt because he falls down a lot but he wants to compete anyway. he has had 12 concussions from hitting his head when he falls and he dislocated his shoulder one time trying to clear the bar that they put too high for him. So I think they should change the rules so that he can pole vault lower and still win and not have to go so high in the air like the other bigger, stronger, faster kids. That would solve the problem right? Doesn't that make sense to everyone here? Or are some of you so barbaric that you think he should just have to suffer all of those injuries and the sport should allow it to continue? Or maybe, maybe he should ...I know...try a different sport that he is more suited for. Again, men’s lacrosse is not for everyone to play and that is okay. Let us coach, referee and play the game the way it has been played, well and safely, since the 1930’s and LONG before.From the US Lacrosse website under the category Don’t Fix it if it Ain’t Broken:Field lacrosse is sometimes perceived to be a violent and dangerous game, however, injury statistics prove otherwise. While serious injuries can and do occur in lacrosse, the game has evolved with an emphasis on safety, and the rate of injury is comparatively low. Ensuring the safety of participants is a major focus for US Lacrosse and its Sports Science and Safety Committee, which researches injury data in the sport and makes recommendations to make the game as safe as practicable.Finally, to the parents/grandparents who commented here about their children having 5-6 concussions and punctured lungs and having to be taken to the hospital several times...Why are they back out on the field? Maybe instead of asking the sport of lacrosse to change, maybe your player needs to change sports. 5 or 6 concussions to a kid is more than I saw in a 5 year boxing career. It is not healthy and it is way out of the norm for lacrosse. My son has played lacrosse for 8 years, 2 seasons per year and has never had a concussion. What is the difference? Something to think about. Lacrosse is not for everyone. Really.And again Mr. President, what was the outcome of the hit that motivated this latest article? I believe the team said the player was "doing fine."

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

The sport is in need of training across the board. Due to the growth, we have coaches who have never played and are not educated in the rules, proper play or coaching methods. We have officials who have read a book but do not truly know the difference between a legal and illegal check. In the winter, they are doing hockey or basketball. I recently asked a local ref why he and his follow ref were reluctant to call pushes and cross checks to the back. I was told it would slow the game down too much. Shouldn't a ref's primary role be the safety of a player? Serious injury can and will be the outcome. Players can and have had their necks broken while playing because they were hit in a defenseless position - either from behind or going for a ground ball. The first play should always be the ball. This is what should be coached at the youth level and carried into high school and college. It is the better play anyhow, as the player checking often nevers gets the ground ball. It is time to enforce the rules that exist and stop letting coaches, players and refs not follow them. It's for the integrity of this great game.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I agree penalties need to be increased and the referees need to be educated and held accountable.

If the current rate of concussion remains the same a lot of intelligent parents will encourage their kids to play other sports. Then where will we be?

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I'm very grateful I'm the parent of a female lacrosse player. The checking has NOTHING to do with playing the ball. Smashing into people is not athletics.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

My son was injured reaching down to pick up a loose ball. He took a football type hit that broke his scapula. Of all bone injuries, this bone is broken less than 1% of the time. The cause was clearly the angle, the hit, and pads that are not designed to take hits. I am all in favor of stronger penalties, and more frequent calls, but we should also consider the equipment. We cannot prevent all injuries, but a better chest/back pad may have prevented this injury.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

These new proposed rule changes would be good progress for the youth game and for high school & college levels - for the players and I think for coaches who encourage the violent "take-out" hit as game strategy. We played one such team several times this season and the coach had his player take-out two of our players - one concussed so badly that his season ended with that one hit, and the second during a playoff game. Especially when this kind of idiocy is encouraged by the coach, the refs need to be uniformly trained and uniformly confident that ejecting the offending player and/or the adult is not only the "right" call, but the only one that is appropriate.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve, I agree in principal that all high hits need a heavy penalty (ejection). Take out checks should be all but gone, head slashes a 2-minute penalty, one allowed. But we are faced by a truly handicapped referee pool. Many out here (in the west) are getting minimal training and can't call the game for "better" or "worse". Three step rule is great for kids, especially the under 13 crowd. However, I do fear eliminating body to body contact will do more harm than good. We see "good" physical play all the time but what we don't see are refs that know how to manage it. Let's do more to educate and demand higher standards for the refs and coaches. More education and enforcement of existing rules before changing the game forever.....please.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

THANK YOU STEVE!!!
With the explosion of lacrosse in Colorado over the past decade, the lack of true lacrosse coaches has led to many football coaches filling in the gaps on their offseason. What they do well is teach kids how to hit and not necessarily play the game of lacrosse. A close body check should still be allowed but a a take out check to an unaware player who is not playing the ball should never be tolerated as well as head contact. If Michael V. has not seen that many concussions, I would like to get into that league. Here in Denver, there are multiple concussions at every weekend tournament.

As far as the above comment about coaches and players targeting good players to get them out of the game, it is routine here in Colorado both in lacrosse and ice hockey. I personally know multiple playes 'taken out' of the game.

Last word, if US lacrosse doesn't fix it, the lawyers will gladly do so as witnessed by the recent passage of various concussion laws in the states including one here in Colorado. Coaches and referees, watch out, litigation is on the way.
Good luck.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I am a coach for my son's team at the youth level, played through college into adult leagues, and reffed summer ball for years, and I think people are getting confused between legal and illegal contact. Absolutely head shots/helmet to helmet and cross-checks are illegal, always have been, and any bodycheck on defenseless (not holding the ball) players has been unnecessary roughing. However, if my hands are together and I check you in the front when you are carrying the ball, without extending my arms, that is legal no matter how hard I hit you. As for the concussions, I never saw anyone get one while I played, and our helmets were much bulkier (safer?) than today's streamlined designs. Same for the chincy gloves they're selling today. My son wears my old L35's and they are still better. I played defense, and if a player was on the crease we put him on the ground. That's lacrosse, and that's why I steered my son away from football into lacrosse. Instead of being hit by 3 or four guys like in football, you are hit by only one guy. Interestingly, I have seen that violent slashing has gotten way out of hand because kids aren't playing the body at all but just whacking away at the arms and hands and often hit the helmet going for the head of the stick. Also, with sticks being so technologically advanced today even compared to my time, you can't get the ball out of some guys' sticks no matter how hard you check it, and I'm not going to let you back yourself up to my goal and take a point blank shot. Please enforce illegal/dangerous hits, please teach your players how to properly check, but don't remove the clean contact that makes this game men's lacrosse and has helped the sport grow immensely in my state of New Hampshire as a great alternative to football.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I agree with stronger rules, especially in those areas where lacrosse is a new sport. There is an even greater issue within this one, that is the age level vs grade level lacrosse discrepancies across the country. I am from Boston, but now live in Texas. Lacrosse is a newer sport here, with football players being the first to sign up. These football players have been "red shirted" in kindergarten. Thus, they are often 1-2 years older than kids who entered kindergarten when they were supposed to. My son is a May birthday, and there are kids in his very own grade that are 1.5 years older then he. There is one boy, that is a grade below him, yet one year older than he (held back 2 years!). This is commonplace in Texas, and these boys know how to hit. They are often better at the physical game than the tactical one. And North Texas Lacrosse will NOT adopt the age requirements! This means there can be a 3 year age difference on the field of 5/6 graders or 7/8 graders. Couple that with a difference in when I child enters puberty, and you have a recipe for some very dangerous scenarios. USA Lacrosse should mandate age requirements for those locations who will not prioritize players safety!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve,
Thank you, again, for your experience, your opinion, and for making changes for the better. As the mother of two boys playing lacrosse from the earliest years into now high school, I cannot agree more that the time has come to enforce the rules regarding violent collisions. I also support that the game has changed since my days of lacrosse in Maryland. Now in New Jersey, I see coaches, officials, and worst of all, parents, who haven't got a clue how lacrosse is played or what the nature of the game is. The kids are coming into the sport from hockey and football and soccer 'to stay conditioned' and assuming the rules of the game are similar to the sports they've come from. The coaches and parents are coming from the same places, and likewise, 'teaching' and 'coaching' the sport with complete disregard for the rules. I cannot tell you how many times I've had to stare down a 'football' dad whose screaming for more and harder hits from his kid. I've heard parents holler for their kids, whose team is the lowest seeded and out after this game, to take out the kids from the highest seeded team - which, of course, has games and games to go before the end of the tournament and/or the season. Thankfully, the better team almost always has such great ball control that the offending parent's son's team cannot even get to them, let alone take them out, but boy do those parent's cheer if they even get close! It's disturbing and disgusting - and it doesn't bode well for parents to be the ones asking for better coaching and officiating. Please bear this in mind and keep working from 'the top'. I for one, will keep doing my best to educate the kids and the parents I have the opportunity to address. Becoming a 'Keeper of Lacrosse' is one of the ways I'm trying to do this - and I thank you, and US Lacrosse, for making that program available as well. Here's to the health and well-being of all the kids playing lacrosse, not just the bigger, faster, stronger ones.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Wow! I totally disagree. I'm a former player and coach. Hitting is part of the game. The refs already have discretion to call unnecessary roughness. We don't need more rules like that. As a youth coach, I loved it wheny kids went up against a "football mentality" team that emphasized hitting over finess. We killed 'em every time with better fundamentals and arter play that suckered the excessive hitters into lunging out of position.

Come on! No hitting? Play field hockey!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

As a person who has called a thousand games (not that many in lacrosse) I would like to weigh in.If the cross check was called and penalized as the rule reads it would surely limit some of the rough stuff.Also, officials need to add time on rougher hits, and more importantly make the penalty non-releasable.Any hockey (See the New Jersey Devils) fan will attest to the power of the non-releasable penalty and punishment. The call was gutsy and correct.A coach will teach differently when penalties start costing him games.As ofrficials we have the authority and the rule book to clean this up.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you for addressing this important subject. I completely agree with you. Played well, Lacrosse is a beautiful game and I don't think violent collisions add anything to the game. My 7 year old has started playing this year and we both love playing and practicing. I do worry about violent collisions as he moves up the ranks. I really don't think the game needs the "football style" hits. It is much better with out it. They just seem out of place even in the college game. I'd love to see rules to outline collision style hits.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I appreciate the post and agree that enforcement of existing rules must improve and new rules should be considered to improve safety. My 10-year-old missed several months of LAX (and all other physical activity including normal PE at school) because of a concussion he suffered during a game. He plays goalie and was hit from behind just outside the crease from another player who came out of no where and body checked him with great force, sending him flying in the air only to land on his head when he came down. This should never happen again!!!

We love the sport and plan to make it one of his primary activities going forward--if it doesn't disable him first.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve,

Thanks so much for your timely article. My son has been playing the sport for 3 years (he is now 12). Until now, we haven't had any real issues. This past season, I have noticed a distinct change in player aggressiveness. Last weekend my son suffered his first concussion and is out for the season (I am okay with this based on the play I've seen). The opponent hit him in the head, with a cross-check, and took him off his feet. There was no penalty called. A few minutes later, the same thing happened to one of our other players. Again, no penalty called. In all reality, when the officials cannot control the game, the coach should pull his players from the field. Lacking a move by the coach, the parent should step in. Through this experience, I've learned what to do next time.

Better official training and enforcement of the rules is absolutely needed, without question. For a future blog, I would love to hear about what parents can do on their local level to bring the sport back to what it was meant to be. Maybe some suggestions on how coaches can deal with parents (there was an instance of one parent hitting a parent from an opposing team!). Safety of our children is paramount, especially at a young age.

One of the side effects for my son is excessive irritability. Trust me! It's sooooo not worth it!! :-)

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Totally disagree ... at 50 years of age i have played, coached and been around lacrosse all of my life plus i have 3 sons who all play at a very high level and physical contact is a part of the game. Remove the treat of strong contact and you might as well have the boys and girls play together! Contact is a critical part of the game. That being said, you must be safe. No head hits - Good Idea. No hits when they player is in a vulnerable position (just like the NFL) - good idea. Three yards to make a hit (now you are endangering the defender)? Are you going to rule that Midfielders cannot run down the lane because if someone may hit them? Take away the treat of contact and offensive players will create the contact by running over the defender … now the defenders will be at risk. Make a player hold back and the person how is not at full speed will get hurt. How many times have you seen an offensive player put his head down bull over a defender and either nothing is called or even worst they call the defender for something!!! Are you going to shorten the dead ball starting distance down to 3 yards verse 5? This is crazy talk!!!
If you want to have a serious conversation about how to improve the game and reduce concussions and such then look at the equipment. Compare the lacrosse helmet to a football helmet. Grant it, the lacrosse helmet has come a long long way from the bucket helmets but even today it is of little real protection - and - i suppose that the lacrosse equipment decision makers have chosen to keep the protection at a subpar level if for no reason except to discourage hitting; which frankly is disgraceful! Seriously, have you actually looked at some to the inexpensive helmets … they are nothing but hard foam! Absolutely, no protection here. And the $200 plus helmets, they are not much better! At least compared to a good quality football helmet.
The other issue is that as the sport grows, new players to the game who are footballers are bringing the hard hitting qualities of football to the game. So, do you want the sport to grow or not. Also as the sport grows, the lack of skill will be compensated for by aggressiveness. As the skill comes, the aggressiveness naturally subsides because it is not as valuable as great finesse and skill.
Additionally, concussions ... what a topic ... everybody has a concussion even when they do not. On my high school team this year i had a trainer side line four of my boys with a "concussion". Of the four, three family doctors wrote letters stating that they did not have a concussion and since the trainer had reported it as a concussion, all four players were out for 5 weeks and basically missed the season. This is a real shame because 75% of the players had no health risk at all.
Crazy but this is the new environment and the real danger is that kids, who do not want to miss out, will not admit to actually being hurt. I sidelined one of my guys because i noticed something that concerned me and it turned out to be a concussion (and he missed the rest of the season) BUT that's what good coaching and mentoring is about. Not over active rules.
Bottom Line - remove hitting and you can call it girl’s lacrosse.
Answer – teach the players to play the game correctly, have great officials to protect the safety of the players and give the players the best possible equipment they can have!

OH – ONE LAST THING – for those parents who say that their son’s have had 1, 2 , 3 concussions … I even read 6 concussions in less than one year … what’s a matter with you, why is your son still playing!!!

QUIT WATERING DOWN SPORTS!

Simply put...the time has not come, and should never come to remove "violent" collision from Lacrosse (or any other sport for that matter....what is next .....maybe we can let those in wheelchairs play....or we can play the game in a protective bubble....or possibly play "no touch" Lacrosse?

The idea of making things safer is good...to a point(i.e. elliminating cheap shots, hits from behind, illegal stick use, etc...). But to outlaw honest, straight up, shoulder to body hits is only playing to the weak.

What kind of athlete are we trying to raise/grow? Strong, tough, independant, able to defend themselves/keep their head on a swivel? or those who are weak, afraid, complaining, receiving participation trophies in contact sports simply because the rules changed to accomodate the weaker athletes...

If the weak among us don't like violent contact in sports...they have plenty of options (swimming, walking, running, sewing, golf, baseball, basketball, soccer, Wii, biking)....there are far more "non-violent" options out there...leave the few proud 'real' sports (look up definition of sports please) alone liberals!

And tell youtr lawyers to watch their back!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you for this informative article. Yes, the time has long been coming to change up these rules and redirect the violent behavior. Refs will play a big role in enforcement of reducing needless violence and injury from lacrosse. We all now know the long term effects of concussions and how that impacts the futures of our young players. Why would we knowingly set our children up for a lifetime of permanent brain impairments, depression, addictions, and more? The sooner these improved rules and guidelines are approved and fully enforced, and athletes behaviors are redirected, the better! Thank you!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve - great piece and I couldn't agree more. Personally I have found it troubling that different areas chose to adopt the new rules (CONNY) while others haven't (Long Island), there is no need for children playing U15 or lower to engage in take out checks, period. The weight differentials can be extreme at these ages and I've watched 150lb 12 year-olds demolish 80lb kids to the delight of parents and teammates, who then watch the child get carried off of the field - what is gained by this? It is our job as coaches, administrators, and referees to teach the game and make it safe for the children (children - they are NOT mini adults!). And to be clear by no means do I mean that there should be no contact, it means that take out checks, hitting defenseless players, and cross checking need be penalized appropriately and removed from the game, especially and most importantly at youth levels.

I ask this to those of you that feel these big hits should be allowed - how would you feel if your child severely injured another player, or conversely, if it were your kid that was severely injured by a big hit. Coaches is this what you teach your kids - to injure other players - if so, you have no business teaching anything to children. Is the risk of a severe injury worth that big hit you get to cheer for? We are the adults, we are charged with the safety of these boys and girls, the game is for them, not us.

The new rules were a great first step, however their inconsistent adoption and administration is a problem. The quickest way to have the rules enforced is to work with the insurance carriers to make sure that organizations, tournaments, and referees are required to follow the age appropriate US Lacrosse rules in order to keep their insurance, if organizations and tournaments don't adopt the US Lacrosse rules then the insurance should be pulled and they could be held liable for injuries due to willful violation of the terms of the insurance. Once organizations, tournaments, and referees realize they cannot get insurance or can be held liable the rules will be enforced. As much as I hate this way of handling it, I see no other way of making sure everyone plays by the age appropriate rules that US Lacrosse prescribes.

Play hard, play fair, honor the game.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Absolutely right on! We need to make it clear that lacrosse is NOT a game where thuggish play is welcome, or we'll lose promising players (not just to injury, but to concern about injury that will keep them from playing). Increasing the minimum penalty is a must, because officials with latitude will use it, and players/coaches need to know that it's not worth it.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

the time has come for people to realize, that, when you participate in a physical, competitive sport, the opportunity for injury is ALWAYS present. THIS GAME IS NOT BASKETBALL; and while I am entirely in favor of safety, it's time to get over the crying, the whining, and the sissification of this beautiful game.

this coach will continue to teach tough, intense, physical play - within the rules - and I, myself will continue to appreciate the brave players who are not afraid to CLEAR THE CREASE FOR THEIR GOALIES!

lax4life

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Three basic changes can be made instantly without changing game rules:(1) Train officials to apply heavier non-releasable penalties, including quicker ejections. And make more detailed reports of severe incidents, including reaction of coaches to penalties.(2) Monitor accumulation of severe penalties by a coach's team: a warning, then probation, then single or multiple game suspension.(3)Suspend any player that causes serious injury for as long as his or her victim cannot return to play, starting with the game where injury occurred. Avery Blake H of F '79

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Enough already! Enforce the rules as they now stand and if you aren't willing to take the chance don't play. Lets not become the USSA (United Safety States of America). You can get hurt anywhere doing anything at anytime. What's next, walking helmets?

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

It needs to start early. At a 7th grade tournament on Long Island last week one very prominent team's coach instructed his players to "take out" a player on the opposing team. Not in terms of double teaming or even triple teaming or playing tough, but they were told to do "whatever it take" to shut him down. One of the offending team's players apologized to the target saying " Sorry .... If I dont hit you like this coach is going to take me out of the game." Lacrosse stick were being swung like baseball bats at those who had the ball, causing a significant hemotomas. A DI college player who saw one of the players after stated he had never seen such bruising on a 12 year old. Not one referee did anything to stop this

Parents of the offending team were drunk (too many bloody maries on a sunday morning)directly taunting the other teams players and encourage their children to "take (them) out" and "check him low (at the knees)".

Absolutely digusting and a disservice to the honor of the game.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

From my viewpoint As a Boys Youth Official, serious body checking needs to be taken out of games for the Seventh and Eight grade levels (U15) due to siginificant differences in the height and weight of the players. Perhaps Youth Lacrosse should use the weight limitations used in Youth Football. It is not fun to see a big defenseman apply a normal bodycheck against a much smaller attackman who can sustain a shoulder injury from the impact.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Let me approach this from another angle. My son was a star middie for our relatively young and small U9 team. Regular season was fine with minimal crosschecking, all bodychecks called and no more slashing than you might expect from little kids.

We played in a couple travel tournaments and ended up in championship games against much bigger and taller all-star teams. These kids were trained to crosscheck, push kids to the ground and were bodychecking. The refs were young, but well-intended. The problem is that the refs were used to the feel and flow of high school lacrosse. They simply didn't call cross-checks except to the head. All pushing was OK unless directly to the back (and a big 3rd grader pushing and cross-checking a small second grader to the ground is pretty effective D). In the first game, our coaches had to go bezerk to get the refs to disallow bodychecking. In the second, the refs told us they were only calling body contact if player took more than 2 steps.

Probably worse, in the first championship game, the coaches were yelling at their kids to "put them on the ground" and "take out their #x", primarily against my son. He was indeed put on the ground 4-5 times that game and we had another middie knocked out of the game. In the second game, the 3 dads of their first midfield constantly yelled at their sons to "Take out [my son]". Boy, my wife didn't like that. Again, he was taken to the ground 4-5 times and another of our middies (1st grader) was knocked out of the game. (Hence why I called both these games "Bad News Bears vs Cobra Kai".)

Quite apart from the egregious sportsmanship, U.S. LACROSSE SHOULD TAKE STEPS TO MAME SURE U9 AND U11 REGS KNOW HOW TO CALL A GAME DIFFERENTLY AND WHERE TO DRAW THE LINE. If they aren't trained to referee those games much differently than high school or what they see in college lacrosse, you end up with much too physical gameplay than is age-appropriate. They see older players cross-check, so why call it on U9's? And when kids can crosscheck and push other kids to the ground, what does it really mean to disallow bodychecking? As others have commented, the risk of concussions is real, and there is no need for a kid to pick up one in U9 or U11.

P.S.

The good news is my son kept picking himself off the turf and told his Mom "I guess this is why I play football." And that somehow our little pick-up travel team won both games and sent Cobra Kai home unhappy.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve - I could not agree more with your basic premise. I think US Lacrosse should convene a committee of coaches and officials from all age levels to evaluate the current rules and investigate opportunities to change the rules to better protect the players. One the one hand I feel like the current rules on the topic - Illegal Body Check, Unnecessary Roughness, and Cross-Checking - probably are capable of controlling the behavior. The problem I see is that we have had these rules "forever" and they aren't working. Can we rely on enforcement changes and "points of emphasis" to make the game safer? Here is an example: Player A is basically stationary as he competes for a ground ball that is at his feet. Player B on the other team takes a 10 yard run and delivers a "legal" body check (not a cross-check, not targeting the head). Player A suffers a concussion when his head hits the ground. The only call available to the official here is Unnecessary Roughness. My experience as a high school coach is that this is a very unfrequently called infraction. Can we get officials to use the Unnecessary Roughness rule to make the changes we need in player safety? I'm not sure. We should also look at a "Charging" rule modeled after ice hockey.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve - I fully support your position on this. If the NFL can take steps to protect defenseless players it should be easy for us. I think a place to start is to make protection of shooters and goalies a point of emphasis. Players who have just released a shot are exposed and vulnerable (much like a QB who has just released a pass). Violent body checks after the release of the shot are a common source of injury. Even if the check is otherwise legal (not head to head, not "late", not a crosscheck), if delivered with enough force can lead to a concussion, especially whrn the players head hits the ground. Goalies who have left the crease in the clear are vulnerable because they do not wear the same protective equipment as field players. Additionally, for some reason goalies seem to be targeted for far more than their share of late hits after releasing a pass.

In addition to these points of emphasis, I think the officials need to build on the momentum they have for eliminating hits that target the head. Officials should be even more aggressive in using multi-minute and unreleasable calls in response to this behavior. Although many would argue the point, I think expulsion should be "on the table" for particularly violent, aggregious, and un-necessary hits that are designed to injure - not make a lacrosse play.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I've been playing lacrosse for almost thirty years. Now I spend more time coaching. And, later this summer I'll get certified as an official. I see the game from the vantage point of a veteran player and coach. Contact is part of the game. But, I'm sure most will agree, brutality need not be. I don't believe that body checks should be eliminated. However, I do feel that ever improving equipment, conditioning and teaching players how to move, manage themselves and defend themselves is crucial. And, I'll just come out and say it... We all take grim satisfaction in a good, clean, well-timed, solid hit. That said, we coaches need to teach players how to check properly (as opposed to recklessly head hunt). There can be a difference between physical and violent. Brian Patrick Cork

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Body checking is part of the game Otherwise its not Lacrosse its something else First change the design of the stick heads back to the way they were.. a good stick check dislodges the ball the added force is no longer necessary Second three steps only for the defender , no running hits Third no body checking until High School Emphasis on the tactics stick skills and SPORTSMANSHIP the Creators Game was built on I remember every good hit I put on a guy and we shook hands when the game was over As a former player and now a Youth Referee I love this "game"Steve I played one summer with you many years ago and I get where you're coming from We need to get EVERY COACH AT EVERY LEVEL to lay off the macho stuff and focus on the GAME not hard hits Don't make this game anything other than what it is..a tough challenging game thats not for everybody.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

It seems all the comments support reducing violence by some means, whether more penalties or enforcing current rules. So if everyone supports this, how does the violence and injury continue?
I object to "Crooked Arrows" because it seems to promote and condone illegal checking and hitting, and suggests the way to handle that is for the other team to get better. It didn't seem to do much to "Honor the Game".

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

If you cannot or are unwilling to take a hit, then maybe the game is not for you. While the focus of the game should be on other aspects, a well placed body check can mean he difference in a solid slide and a failed attempt at chasing the stick. Lacrosse is unique in that there are different play types for different body types. Unlike other sports, a player can be successful regardless of his stature by learning to play to his advantages. For a larger, slower player, brute force may be his best tool, whereas a smaller player may play to his strength of quickness and finess. To penelize brute force is to unbalanced a once balanced game. As a former high school player, I implore parents and coaches to start punishing the illegal hits, like hits from behind and cross checks, but dont punish the a clean, two handed, from-the-front, textbook body check, simply because of its ferocity. And as for laccrosse never being intended to be football...it's original intention was to take the place of a war, between to tribes. In original lacrosse, death was a common occurence, if you really want to play lacrosse how it was originaly intended, be my gueast.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

While I wholeheartedly agree with Steve's intent to remove the blatantly illegal use of sticks and body parts as part of physical contact, especially to the head and neck, I totally disagree with the concept or intent to remove violent collision from the boys game. As a player, official, father, uncle and grandfather of current players, I take that point of view.
Collision and even violent collision has been a part of the game since its inceeption. Physical intimidation, especially in the crease area, has always been a legitimate part of game strategy. When we played the game with solid wooden sticks, leather helmets without faceguards, and wore hockey or football pads to lessen the effects of contact or misguided stick checks, the "buddy check" was permissable... and that allowed one of the most violent forms of collision imaginable. That, rightfully, has been removed from the game in the name of safety.
Player size and speed has improved, but so has the quality of equipment to offset that. Shortening the run distance for body checks may only serve to increase the focus on how those checks can be delivered with more contact impact to compensate for the lowered speed.
The onus of improving safety for players lies first with coaches, then players themeselves, whose coaching and education in the game needs to emphasize appropriate and responsible contact. Then the officials have to (1)understand commonly what is allowable and (2) enforce that ... and yes, I do suppport increasing the severity of penalty for obviously intentional harmful contact - what used to be called unnecessary roughness or, even, unsportsmanlike conduct.
I think we have the rules structure in place to accomplish what I think we all agree upon, which is to continuously improve the safety of the game. But this can be accomplished through a combination of strategies ... and removing collision, and occasionally violent collision, from the boys game is NOT the answer.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

No hits=no popularity. Society gravitates towards violence. It is a physical sport so don't come out if you know you could get hurt. And if you are scared,...go to church

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve,
Nice article. I am a member of the Pa Keystone Ref Assc and we as an organization are making it our number one priority enforcing the late, violent hits. We are evaluated during games and when we miss a high hit we are called to task for it. We enforce these high hits with usually a minimum two minute penalty. Our number one concern is the safety of the players and as a father, coach and referee I expect my son and my players to respect their opponents and the game. To me the sidelines are our worst enemy as I can constantly hear parents and coaches yelling first for missed calls and then in the same breath when we do make the call, "let them play". Every organization needs to heed the guidance that US Lacrosse provides us and ultimately we all will enjoy the sport more. thx

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

More rules. More protective gear. Let's all head down to the bubble wrap store and envelope the boys in some of that. Lacrosse is and has been a physical game with contact. Rules are clear about the most intentional and most inadvertent contact with and to the head. Enforce them. We are not playing soccer by choice. The Ancients played this game many times as a prelude to or in lieu to war. Dropping gloves has no place in the field game and has been gone for decades. Excellent rule change. When does the over protection stop. How many men learned the value of taking a hit and bouncing back from our regal and awesome Game? How many of us took a hard hit and thought about quitting the game and didn't. Society is robbing our young men of opportunities to learn about themselves and become men. More rules , stiffer penalties ,more equipment what's next? Let the boys play. Let boys learn to become men through the physicality of our great Game. There are immediate and long term advantages to paying attention to your environment so as not to get one's clock cleaned. Do not interfere with one of the ancient purposes for the Game. Dont let our Tradition rich and driven game become one more casualty of the PC AYSO mentality.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I believe one aspect that many overlook is the offensive heads. The pockets have become so pinched that at times, the only way to get ball out is to deliver a body check. Open the heads more and you will see less body checking, better stick work, and hopefully less injuries.

As for illegal and just plain "cheap shots"...... coaches, parents and refs must be more strict about this. I personally bench my players for an entire game if they choose to play this way. Works well!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I agree with your points on the elimination of violent contact, and returning the game to a solidly refereed, well-played game that draws in new players and keeps the attention of the fans.
I've been reading through the replies and I see them from a number of categories: concerned/surprised parents of players, thoughtful agreement/disagreement and discussions of rules and equipment, and blustery bravado-laden disagreements.
For the concerned parents, I have played and coached, and I've always been "the little guy" on the field. When playing, I enjoy that I must work harder and be more aware than some of the larger players, simply because it proves to me that my work and practice pay off. When coaching, to a certain degree, I want my kid and his teammates to understand that you have to be aware and prepared, no one is going to take a legal (or illegal) hit for you. You need to keep your eyes up and be aware. That said, I still want to temper that with a response to the "he-man" replies.
This awareness that kids need on the field to avoid some contact and to be a better player, is NOT innate. It is taught and it requires time and encouragement. When another player, whose coach/parent/ideas about the game are skewed to simply favor physical size simply runs into another player working on these skills, it does nothing to grow or encourage young players in this sport. This issue is a big enough reality that this post was written and the number of replies demonstrates the concern. If you are truly such a great advocate and player/coach of lacrosse, then you will be looking for solutions to these issues. And a solution is not: "your kids are a bunch of wimpy pansies. I'm going to coach my kids to push them on the ground, cause that's what works for me..." If that's the case, much like many asking that kids with numerous concussions not play, PLEASE STOP COACHING. You are neither growing the sport nor helping to encourage new players to try it. You are simply teaching your teams to bully/intimidate/injure any kid that looks a likely target. If you are coaching below a high school level, your concern should be to grow every player on that field, not just put up another "W". If that isn't your main focus, if you are not out to teach kids the fundamentals unique to lacrosse (passing/scooping/cradling/etc.), and your training for anyone under 12 includes instruction on how to time/aim a full speed hit, then you need to take some time, attend some of the coaching clinics/training from US Lacrosse, and understand what the youth game is about.
Consistent ref'ing would do a lot for growth, since coaches will coach to the rule enforcement and parents will expect the same game in two places. But I'm not sure that the equipment needs to be pushed to update faster. WE can't put kid sin pillow suits and ask them play. We also can't have equipment that prices out new players from starting the sport. In the end, parents must push associations to demand trained refs. Players must be taught to give and receive the traditional level of contact from the game. This is another definition that USLacrosse will be asked to provide. Keep the game, honor the game and evolve the game.
For parents; yes, your child is going to get hit by other kids playing lacrosse, and sometimes, it's not going to make sense to you, but it will be a legal hit and it will still hurt. Teach your kids to assess how much it hurts, and if they are able, dust themselves off and get back in the game.
For coaches/players; Respect that every person on that field is important to someone on the sideline. They may not be your kid/brother/sister/whatever, but they are SOMEONE's. Treat them as if they were your own. If winning overcomes your concern for someone else's safety... get off the field. Although I understand the need for contact and that it is an analogy to life, there is no place in any sport for those that would take joy in the injury of others.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

It is very likely that hitting will eventually be removed from boy's/men's lacrosse eventually anyway. As a coach for boy's and girl's as well as a mens official, the difference in the games is startling! The womens game has taught me that finesse and skill will trump physicality any day. The hitting is not needed and if the kids are TAUGHT the proper skills and field awareness, there is no need for hitting. Show me a team that hits a lot and I will show you a team that is not well coached and has poor skills.

I agree, change the rules and phase the violence out of the game... it really is not needed.... this game can evolve!

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Well said! My 14 yr old had his first year of playing this past Spring. I must say I was a bit shocked to see full cuts (with no intent to play the ball) by several players. In one game it wasn't until the same player was on his 3rd high power cut that he was asked to step out (this only after the coach and parents became upset, and the boys suffered injuries). Upon leaving the boys coach praised him on his aggression and "tough playing".I only hope this sport does not turn into what is occurring on the football fields.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Thank you Steve. As an official I have seen countless football hits on the field. Changing the rule is one things, however, like Michael V stated, we need to go back to basics. Not just the players,but the coaches as well. Some players will only do what his/ her coach will allow/ instruct them to do. I like what K. C is doing. If the player is making a violent hit then he should come out of the game. Knowing they will not be able to play will stop them from the violent hits.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I completely agree...with some of the reason deaths of former NFL players that are believe to be attributed to head injuries, I certainly don't want to fathom that I am encouraging my son to play a sport that might later on cause brain damage (please see Washington Post Writers Group - by George F. Will)..great food for thought.

So, now I ask, how to we make this fun games that goes back to the days of Native Americans, into something that is safer than Football, but still enjoyed by many? Thank you.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

Steve - Thanks for this article. The "football type" hit has no place in lacrosse. It adds nothing to the game and only threatens the safety of players. Lacrosse is about speed, skill, and heart. There are plenty of ways to be physical and deliver a body check without blowing someone up with a football type hit. A simple rule that prohibits "knock down" hits as opposed to contact that moves or stops an opposing player might work. In any event this should immediately be implemented for all age groups up through high school at the very least.
Thanks - Bill

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I coach the high school team in bloomington indiana. I grew up playing in New York and canada and i have to admit i was one of the ones who hated to see the violent side of lax go. then one of my players had a pretty serious one that ended all sports for him. he had one in hockey about 6 months earlier. ( i coach that too) he passed the impact test and was cleared a couple of weeks later he was cleared. turns out the test didnt work this time. he finished hockey season and all of lax season and his mom knew something wasnt right. she took him to a neurologist and it turns out he never got over the first one 6 months earlier! it could have killed him. luckily we caught it in time. pay attention coaches and parents, if grades are slipping it may not be the girls. watch for signs and know when to say enough. ive had between 20 and 30 myself. Ive had a headache 24/7 for 20 years and thats easily not the worst part. this is a real issue and it needs to be fixed.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

DON'T!!! Don't take out of lacrosse what so many sports are missing. With any physical activity there is risk. Certainly some people like your view and others would start playing lacrosse as a result of eliminating the elevated risk. More people, particularly current players, will be disappointed and not play. If athletes don't want physical collisions as part of a strategy of playing tough then they should play soccer. The game is what it is, leave it alone.

Re: The Time Has Come to Remove Violent Collision from Men's Lacrosse

I write in complete support of this article. I am a non-lacrosse playing parent who has suffered four concussions over my life. I know full well the effects. I can refer to two incidents related to this topic.
My son, a talented varsity freshman attack at the time, was one on one with a goalie in a fall ball tournament. As he turned to get the shot off the goalie smashed him in the head with a cross check. My son went down, fortunately not out. After being helped off the field he missed much of the rest of that quarter. He returned for the fourth quarter. When I talked to him after the game all he would say is, "My head hurts so much." Fortunately, again, he was not diagnosed with a concussion. Close call. But the hit was totally unnecessary. The penalty: one minute for unnecessary roughness. In my view the goalie should have been ejected.
This summer during the UNC Tournament one of my son's teammates suffered a concussion in the classic loose ball situation described: a number of players fighting for the ball, some guy on the other team took a run into the group and smashed the boy in the head. Concussion, missed the rest of the tournament. Penalty: one minute for unnecessary roughness.
The situation is absurd on its face. That a player should risk brain damage due to playing this beautiful sport is ridiculous. I, sufferer of four concussions, fully support the views of the writer.

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